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truthbknown
Regular Forum Member
171 Posts |
 Posted - Oct 09 2009 : 3:45:21 PM
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Purplelady,
I commend you for sharing your story. I understand how you feel about your business, that is what's sad about our world today. |
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purplelady
New Forum Member
25 Posts |
Posted - Oct 09 2009 : 3:55:12 PM
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| I'll thank you in a hurry, truth, before I am censored again. |
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Petunia
Forum Member
99 Posts |
Posted - Oct 09 2009 : 4:08:00 PM
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| Perhaps the reason the KCCC has graduation at the Naz is the large, airconditined facilty that comfortably accomodates all family and friends with no worries about weather. Maybe at little or no cost to the school. Why would high school graduates want to hold their ceremony at a school they never attended? |
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Editor
Administrator
USA
2373 Posts |
Posted - Oct 09 2009 : 4:16:52 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by purplelady
I have no reason to lie about what happened to my son at the Carrer Center. I am not involved in local politics and cannot vote in the Mt Vernon School Board race. It is very very interesting that Mr. Kirk's version of the incident is believed. He is a politician. Everyone was asked to rise for a prayer. My son said "I don't have to stand for this ****" and he was ordered to the office because he swore. While he was there he was asked about his religious beliefs, and then given an in-school suspension.
While I was discussing this thread with him he said how interesting it was that it was Mr. Kirk was the one offering the prayer. Maybe he was mistaken, but the fact is, there was a public prayer offered that everyone needed to participate in. My son claims it was Mr. Kirk....take it for what it's worth. Please don't censor me.
Not trying to talk down to you, please don't take it that way - but you said yourself "Maybe he (your son) was mistaken" about it being Mr. Kirk. That statement right there is a good enough reason that the allegation could have been faulty and therefore could have caused undue harm to Mr. Kirk in the election. I have no stake in this whatsoever other than wanting to be responsible and bring the truth to my readers.
Would it be fair if someone accused him of that and it wasn't in fact him? It has the potential to sway others' view on his character, and if the case was presented in error, that's not right.
I'm not attacking you, but just trying to show you the potentially damaging side of speech that we don't stop and consider when we make assertions about people without being totally sure if they're true or not. Being a business owner, I can hope you'd appreciate that.
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curious mind
Senior Forum Member
19920 Posts |
Posted - Oct 09 2009 : 4:23:25 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by seabiscuit
I'm posting the link and text but you are right, you can no longer access it by going to the Bible On the Desk website. It's gone now. It was in my cache so I am copying it and pasting it.
http://www.bibleonthedesk.com/communitycouncil.php
The Community Council for Free Expression
The Community Council For Free Expression first came together in April 2008 as a “steering committee” and a voice from the Mt. Vernon Community to support Middle School Science Teacher, John Freshwater, in his stand to keep the Bible on his desk. The group soon felt that the issue was much bigger than just John Freshwater so they adopted the name “Community Council For Free Expression.”
The leaders of the CCFE all live in the Mount Vernon, Ohio, area. They come from diverse backgrounds and churches, but all support John in his battle to keep the Bible on his desk where it has been for the last 21 years. Even though the Mount Vernon School Board has levied other allegations against John in order to move the debate away from the Bible on the desk the CCFE believe that he will be fully exonerated. Then the issue will move back to the Bible on the desk.
The following are the leaders of the Community Council For Free Expression:
Don Matolyak is Pastor of Trinity Assembly of God in Mt. Vernon and has been John Freshwater’s Pastor for more than 14 years.
Dan Whisner is Pastor of Colonial City Baptist Church in Mt. Vernon. He also leads the Ohio Legislative Watch.
Thom Collier is the Ohio State Representative for the 90th District and local business man.
William Kepko is an attorney in Mt. Vernon, OH.
Bill Fulda is Pastor of the First Church of God in Mt. Vernon and serves as President of the Knox Network of Christian Ministries.
Steve Thompson is a Vice President with the Ariel Corporation and has lived his entire life in the Mt. Vernon area.
Dewey Morrow is a retired Pastor & District Supervisor with the Foursquare Gospel Church.
The Community Council For Free Expression is a non-profit corporation and has developed a Legal Defense Fund to help with John Freshwater’s legal expenses. Those wishing to donate to this fund can give via credit card on this web site or write your check to
The Community Council For Free Expression
c/o Trinity Assembly of God
1051 Beech Street
Mt. Vernon, OH 43050
This is not surprising. It's a little like the disappearance of the Minutemen website after the Freshwater situation gained national media attention. It's a bit bothersome.
So Thompson tried to distance himself from the above and it was recently deleted from the website, and Kirk is denying Purplelady's assertions.
Remind anyone of these passages from the New Testament?
66 And as Peter was beneath in the palace, there cometh one of the maids of the high priest: 67 And when she saw Peter warming himself, she looked upon him, and said, And thou also wast with Jesus of Nazareth.
68 But he denied, saying, I know not, neither understand I what thou sayest. And he went out into the porch; and the **** crew. 69 And a maid saw him again, and began to say to them that stood by, This is one of them.
70 And he denied it again. And a little after, they that stood by said again to Peter, Surely thou art one of them: for thou art a Galilaean, and thy speech agreeth thereto. 71 But he began to curse and to swear, saying, I know not this man of whom ye speak.
Fascinating.............
"You might have to fight a battle more than once to win it" - Margaret Thatcher
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cateyes
Senior Forum Member
USA
2930 Posts |
Posted - Oct 09 2009 : 4:26:36 PM
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I am wondering...if the prayer time/ space was started by an adult...who turned that space of time to a student...who then lead the prayer..which is how I have heard it many times in other schools.
“On every unauthoritative exercise of power by the legislature must the people rise in rebellion or their silence be construed into a surrender of that power to them? If so, how many rebellions should we have had already?” —Thomas Jefferson
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FTM
Regular Forum Member
USA
357 Posts |
Posted - Oct 09 2009 : 4:31:36 PM
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| I don't know but, I would like to know, was Mrs/Ms Barone the person that ignited, this whole Freshwater mess? |
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purplelady
New Forum Member
25 Posts |
Posted - Oct 09 2009 : 4:32:40 PM
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| I have just had another conversation with my son, who stated that there was no question in his mind that it was Mr. Kirk that led the prayer....all the students were required to stand....it was the first anniversary of 9-11, and the prayer was addressed to God and mentioned Jesus. I can understand why Mr. Kirk would likely deny this happened. If prayer in school is such a desired thing, who would consider this an attack? |
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truthbknown
Regular Forum Member
171 Posts |
Posted - Oct 09 2009 : 4:34:45 PM
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ftm-
what? Please explain, I must have missed something! |
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curious mind
Senior Forum Member
19920 Posts |
Posted - Oct 09 2009 : 4:38:53 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by FTM
I don't know but, I would like to know, was Mrs/Ms Barone the person that ignited, this whole Freshwater mess?
No....Daubenmire, Cline, the father and son Erwin team, and Freshwater himself ignited the "Freshwater incident" soon after Freshwater refused to comply with a directive from the school Administration. 
"You might have to fight a battle more than once to win it" - Margaret Thatcher
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purplelady
New Forum Member
25 Posts |
Posted - Oct 09 2009 : 4:45:57 PM
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| Btw Adam, I do believe rockbiter was there. |
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seabiscuit
Senior Forum Member
USA
1476 Posts |
Posted - Oct 09 2009 : 5:42:43 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Petunia
Perhaps the reason the KCCC has graduation at the Naz is the large, airconditined facilty that comfortably accomodates all family and friends with no worries about weather. Maybe at little or no cost to the school. Why would high school graduates want to hold their ceremony at a school they never attended?
Maybe it is why they did it but that doesn't supercede the conflict of having a public school activity in a religious setting. It is a public school and the Nazarene College church is a religious setting. It's just that simple!
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seabiscuit
Senior Forum Member
USA
1476 Posts |
Posted - Oct 09 2009 : 5:53:21 PM
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purplelady
Thanks for standing your ground on your story. There are many of us that have seen wrong doings in our local school system and have even stated them directly to the powers that be. Nothing changes except that we're learning that there are more people out there who have had experiences that they feel are inappropriate for our public schools and I'm including more than just inappropriate religious activity.
If our schools are ever going to improve we must be able to share our experiences so that others with common thought know that they are not alone. You might be surprised the support you would have but I also understand the trepidation you have to go public with your story.
Adam
At this point, regardless of whether Mr. Kirk said the prayer (although I believe he did) or condoned it by not stopping the activity or changing it to a moment of silence, he should answer to that and not be allowed to squelch the commentary so quickly. As a taxpayer I have the right to the truth.
What makes me angry is that if these people believe so strongly in what they are doing, why aren't they just saying what they have done or are doing because it's what they believe in and fight for it instead of pretending that they are following State mandates and then participating in the acts anyway. It's what Mr. Freshwater has done and so many of his supporters. It's getting old. If you believe it in, stand up for it or go someplace that supports your views. |
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seabiscuit
Senior Forum Member
USA
1476 Posts |
Posted - Oct 09 2009 : 6:00:06 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by FTM
I don't know but, I would like to know, was Mrs/Ms Barone the person that ignited, this whole Freshwater mess?
Where have you been for the past year plus? Mr. Freshwater is the one who decided to go to the Square to hold a "vigil" of sorts and it was Mr. Cline who called the Columbus media to get them there. That is what has been testified in court.
Mrs. Barone was presented with a Subpoena and called as a witness by the school's attorney.
Any more questions? |
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Editor
Administrator
USA
2373 Posts |
Posted - Oct 09 2009 : 6:13:07 PM
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Moderating a forum will always present with challenges and tough decisions. I know some aren't happy with the way I handled the situation. You'll have that.
My point is this: Certain allegations have the potential to inflict damage. Purplelady stated that her son could have been mistaken, but then said later that she contacted him and he was sure it was Mr. Kirk. That demonstrates that upon posting the comment, there was doubt in her mind as to whether it was actually Mr. Kirk who said the alleged prayer. But she still chose to make the statement.
The devil's advocate would say, based on her declaration of being a business owner, that she should have known better than anyone the need to be absolutely certain of something before making an allegation. If anything, my action serves as a reminder of the need to consider the impact of words before typing away. Unprotected speech has ramifications. |
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