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seabiscuit
Senior Forum Member
USA
1476 Posts |
 Posted - Oct 15 2009 : 7:35:05 PM
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cateyes
I understand what you are saying. However in this instance, the man is trying to get on the very organization that he is helping his friend sue. That is a conflict of interest. Nothing more, nothing less.
If you read the verbage for the Community Council for Free Expression it states:
The leaders of the CCFE all live in the Mount Vernon, Ohio, area. They come from diverse backgrounds and churches, but all support John in his battle to keep the Bible on his desk where it has been for the last 21 years. Even though the Mount Vernon School Board has levied other allegations against John in order to move the debate away from the Bible on the desk the CCFE believe that he will be fully exonerated. Then the issue will move back to the Bible on the desk.
http://www.bibleonthedesk.com/communitycouncil.php
In this instance, his stance in continuing his support of John through this council may preclude him from being able to do both......nothing more, nothing less. |
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bestrep
New Forum Member
24 Posts |
Posted - Oct 15 2009 : 9:26:08 PM
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| FCA is a "club" until the bell rings at 7:35 am. No different than any other group that is using the facilities without school personnel being paid. Has Mrs. Barone showed herTeacher's Union withdraw card yet? Still a member? Interesting how she brings up the issue about Kirk and 14 pages of forum later she is nowhere to be found. |
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wastintime
Forum Member
73 Posts |
Posted - Oct 15 2009 : 9:53:59 PM
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You're correct, it's a club. And you're also correct, keep it before or after school. Believe me, the times bled into the school day previously, and that's where part of the problem has been. It's been a lack of church/state boundaries with lousy administrative oversight. It's pretty simple.
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cateyes
Senior Forum Member
USA
2930 Posts |
Posted - Oct 16 2009 : 12:43:03 AM
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Seabiscuit..I see and understand your concern..but a TRUE LEGAL conflict I question is there...maybe in the eyes of laymen..but legally I dont think there is.
We need to keep LAW in mind just as the SB must learn to do. I support the ACLJ which has been mentioned here...it is a group of lawyers that legally fight for faith issues in court..many very detailed very in deepth cases..but because I support and GIVE MY MONEY to them...does that mean I could not hold a SB postion..I would hope not...because ME...I know..I could support ACLJ BUT also so a proper job on the SB and follow the law of the land...in fact maybe I would be even MORE sensitive to being careful the school system was in order with the law..and call for legal counsel when I felt there were issues.
Why do I say that..because I get the newsletter of ACLJ and realize..meny cases are REVERSED at higher courts...or an agreement works for both sides.
As I said..I dont know Thompson...I do like his business background..which is so critial for now whoever is on the board.
And remember...IF it is heard some board member is our of line..are you going to sit quiet this time..or yell so all can hear ya?? so another Freshwater case doesnt happen and cost the community...
quote:
Originally posted by seabiscuit
cateyes
I understand what you are saying. However in this instance, the man is trying to get on the very organization that he is helping his friend sue. That is a conflict of interest. Nothing more, nothing less.
If you read the verbage for the Community Council for Free Expression it states:
The leaders of the CCFE all live in the Mount Vernon, Ohio, area. They come from diverse backgrounds and churches, but all support John in his battle to keep the Bible on his desk where it has been for the last 21 years. Even though the Mount Vernon School Board has levied other allegations against John in order to move the debate away from the Bible on the desk the CCFE believe that he will be fully exonerated. Then the issue will move back to the Bible on the desk.
http://www.bibleonthedesk.com/communitycouncil.php
In this instance, his stance in continuing his support of John through this council may preclude him from being able to do both......nothing more, nothing less.
“On every unauthoritative exercise of power by the legislature must the people rise in rebellion or their silence be construed into a surrender of that power to them? If so, how many rebellions should we have had already?” —Thomas Jefferson
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cateyes
Senior Forum Member
USA
2930 Posts |
Posted - Oct 16 2009 : 01:55:12 AM
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Seabisuit....just wanted to say...THANKS FOR THE DEBATE....have enjoyed the respectful way you have challenged my thinking...
The Mothman too..thanks
No need to call each other names...we have stayed on topic...it is a very serious issue for our community...and again thanks for the debate....I have no doubt tomorrows will bring us into debate again...may we continue the respect also.
I am sitll not sure which all will get my vote..I have my adsentee ballot sitting here..but still not sure about some issues...
WE are at a very serious space of time for our comminty..and we need wise people and also people that remember...THEY WORK FOR US...NOT THEMSELVES..
“On every unauthoritative exercise of power by the legislature must the people rise in rebellion or their silence be construed into a surrender of that power to them? If so, how many rebellions should we have had already?” —Thomas Jefferson
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sea breeze
Senior Forum Member
Jamaica
3770 Posts |
Posted - Oct 16 2009 : 07:26:58 AM
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| So, cateyes, are you saying that since YOU don't see a LEGAL CONFLICT with Thompson being on the board,. then YOU are ok with it? What about ETHICAL CONFLICT? |
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Hondo
Regular Forum Member
116 Posts |
Posted - Oct 16 2009 : 07:50:59 AM
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| Ethical? Thompson and Kirk appear to me to be very ethical. They have stated what their beliefs are. Once again..."common sense" should tell voters that their background more than qualifies them to help our students get a good education. If Steve Thompson didn't answer questions posed to him by AT I would have concerns. |
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FTM
Regular Forum Member
USA
357 Posts |
Posted - Oct 16 2009 : 08:12:58 AM
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CM,
I haven't seen your response anywhere as to how many times you've read the report with and Open Mind?
Wonderin,
Yes, I understand where this Freshwater case is at. If they lose this case, the next case will be held in civil court. There probably isn't a lawyer in the world. That wouldn't want to be the lawyers of record, for this slam dunk, cash cow.
The point of this case is, the board prematurely, fired someone without proper doucmentation, to backup the firing. I believe that once the lawyers were involved, you vertically intercoursed the case, from a just or unjust case, to now it is all about money.
I ask this question, if you were a lawyer, would you turn down a third of five million dollars?
Do you stop the bleeding now, or wait until the lawyers have cut a artery? |
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truthbknown
Regular Forum Member
171 Posts |
Posted - Oct 16 2009 : 08:54:46 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by bestrep
FCA is a "club" until the bell rings at 7:35 am. No different than any other group that is using the facilities without school personnel being paid. Has Mrs. Barone showed herTeacher's Union withdraw card yet? Still a member? Interesting how she brings up the issue about Kirk and 14 pages of forum later she is nowhere to be found.
If you would read the report, or anything to do with the case, you will see that FCA took place at the Middle School during lunch. |
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MVDad
Forum Member
59 Posts |
Posted - Oct 16 2009 : 09:08:49 AM
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| Facts are.....The current school board made multiple mistakes in the handling of the Freshwater situation. Therefore, my opinion, all of them should be replaced. Thompson is a good guy, and would certainly do a better job than those in place now. Also, I dont believe any of them asked the kids how they felt about JF as a teacher. If that was done properly, I think they would have found that the vast majority of the students he has taught or was teaching, believe him to be one of the best MV had to offer. I say this with 2 children he taught, and many, many friends of theirs that feel the school board to be, lets say, not the sharpest knives in the drawer. Its been mishandled from the start, its going to cost all of us alot of money, and that blame falls on the current school board. Time to clean house. |
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RBibby
Regular Forum Member
USA
146 Posts |
Posted - Oct 16 2009 : 09:20:41 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by MVDad
Facts are.....The current school board made multiple mistakes in the handling of the Freshwater situation. Therefore, my opinion, all of them should be replaced. Thompson is a good guy, and would certainly do a better job than those in place now. Also, I dont believe any of them asked the kids how they felt about JF as a teacher. If that was done properly, I think they would have found that the vast majority of the students he has taught or was teaching, believe him to be one of the best MV had to offer. I say this with 2 children he taught, and many, many friends of theirs that feel the school board to be, lets say, not the sharpest knives in the drawer. Its been mishandled from the start, its going to cost all of us alot of money, and that blame falls on the current school board. Time to clean house.
A majority of student who like John Freshwater wouldn't necessarily undo disciplinary infractions. That's the point I think you are missing. He could have been the most likable and effective teacher for hundreds of students, but if he breaks the rules, he's subject to punishment like anyone else. I think thats what we are all failing to see here. Sure he may be a super nice guy, a christian and family man, but he isn't immune from doing wrong and still must face the music. |
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truthbknown
Regular Forum Member
171 Posts |
Posted - Oct 16 2009 : 09:31:47 AM
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VERY well said rbibby!!
If we let the children choose one of the Jonas brothers would be president. ( I know, I know many of you would rather have that.......) |
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wizard42
Regular Forum Member
USA
343 Posts |
Posted - Oct 16 2009 : 09:50:23 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by MVDad
Facts are.....The current school board made multiple mistakes in the handling of the Freshwater situation. Therefore, my opinion, all of them should be replaced. Thompson is a good guy, and would certainly s do a better job than those in place now. Also, I dont believe any of them asked the kids how they felt about JF as a teacher. If that was done properly, I think they would have found that the vast majority of the students he has taught or was teaching, believe him to be one of the best MV had to offer. I say this with 2 children he taught, and many, many friends of theirs that feel the school board to be, lets say, not the sharpest knives in the drawer. Its been mishandled from the start, its going to cost all of us alot of money, and that blame falls on the current school board. Time to clean house.
Clean house indeed!! Replace current board members with individuals who would perpetuate the problem, makes sense to me.  |
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curious mind
Senior Forum Member
19920 Posts |
Posted - Oct 16 2009 : 10:19:58 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by RBibby
quote:
Originally posted by MVDad
Facts are.....The current school board made multiple mistakes in the handling of the Freshwater situation. Therefore, my opinion, all of them should be replaced. Thompson is a good guy, and would certainly do a better job than those in place now. Also, I dont believe any of them asked the kids how they felt about JF as a teacher. If that was done properly, I think they would have found that the vast majority of the students he has taught or was teaching, believe him to be one of the best MV had to offer. I say this with 2 children he taught, and many, many friends of theirs that feel the school board to be, lets say, not the sharpest knives in the drawer. Its been mishandled from the start, its going to cost all of us alot of money, and that blame falls on the current school board. Time to clean house.
A majority of student who like John Freshwater wouldn't necessarily undo disciplinary infractions. That's the point I think you are missing. He could have been the most likable and effective teacher for hundreds of students, but if he breaks the rules, he's subject to punishment like anyone else. I think thats what we are all failing to see here. Sure he may be a super nice guy, a christian and family man, but he isn't immune from doing wrong and still must face the music.
RBibby - you said it better than I've been able to - thank you..................
"You might have to fight a battle more than once to win it" - Margaret Thatcher
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larry
Regular Forum Member
146 Posts |
Posted - Oct 16 2009 : 12:48:57 PM
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[quote]Originally posted by seabiscuit
larry
Since you didn't reference the entire post, I had to go back through the 1st 7 pages to find it before I responded.
Before I could do that I had to go over and rake mulch at St. Vincent's (my volunteer work) and begin preparing dinner for my family. Gee, next time I'll make sure you come first.
Okay, there is one post by one poster on the very 1st page of this blog saying they "believe Thompson is part of a group I refer to as the "Christian Taliban"." and then explain what they mean by that. There are also 14 other pages of posts with no name calling.
So, you are right there's one post by one poster that makes a derogatory reference to Mr. Thompson. What else do you need me to say so you feel complete? I've not called him names nor has CM. So your point is what?
I didn't name you or cm did I? Really, how hard is it to go scroll through and find what your looking for? Doesn't matter how many times name calling was done, YOU said my post wasn't factual |
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